Just finished your book. Quite interesting. Nice to see a bit about the “Muddy Charles” in print. Given your field and the theme of the book let me give you an anecdote from MIT 1954.
I took a hit in an economics course when I told Kindleberger that what he was teaching to us couldn’t be meaningful because it did not take into account peoples behavior. I don’t recall his reply exactly but it was something like how you describe Standard economics in your book. I do remember the barely C grade which I attribute to both my public criticism and my subsequent lack of faith in the field. Imagine my disgust(and relief) years later when a Noble Prize was awarded for the same thing. So the pavement for your path at MIT received a rough cut pebble even before your were born. Irrationality was the heart of Standard economics then as now.
Let me give you an anecdote about “morality and character and the Muddy Charles. I was a “post-doctoral” student in the Nutrition and Food Science Dept., Course XX, in the late 60s early 70s. The MC was a popular meeting and drinking spot for a number of our grad students and junior faculty and the beer flowed freely. After buying (and paying)for a couple of rounds and the beer began it’s magic not only did it flow freely it began to flow “free”, libre de costo, at least for those who were in the keg-keepers in group. This free flow continued for some weeks and became to be almost an automatic expectation for some. Did we feel like we were stealing, No, did we consider we were stealing, of course not. It came as if it were a fringe benefit. Almost everyone there could rationalize things based on an assumption that at some point and at some time they had been screwed by the Institute, so lets get even. Besides we’d paid for some beers so, all having been exposed to Course XIV thinking, it was just a matter of the revenue per unit sale being a bit less than expected. No problem drinking that free beer. The flow lasted until the bean counters did find the revenue dropping below expectations and then it stopped. I don’t know of any punishment being administered. No doubt the statute of limitations expired long ago and MIT’s financial status seems quite sound. Probably helped, at least in part, by donations from the irrationally rationalizing imbibers. Perhaps their willingness to contribute to fund raising campaigns has been enhanced by memories of “free beer” at the Muddy Charles. If so, could that make it irrationally moral even though rationally illegal?
Another possible explanation for people not taking the dollar bills from the plate?
Dante: Theoretically, people see money on the counter, and no one around, they think they’re being watched.
Veronica: Honesty through paranoia.
– “Clerks”
After all, a plate of money in a refrigerator is an extremely abnormal situation… whereas, the cokes arouse far less suspicion of a trap.
Still, I agree with your basic conclusion.
(Disclaimer: I just watched the video, I haven’t (yet!) read the book. )
(Also: I took your class, 1.5 years ago, and very much enjoyed it! Thanks.)
I just finished your book and I enjoyed it. Just the test with money and coke – there I miss something. Did you make the same test with writing one’s name on the coke? Did it disappear, too? The difference is obvious – this time people would know from whom they stole the coke. Maybe you need one insider in every kitchen so it is not easy to carry out?!
And unfortunately I have made twice a difference experience concerning money. 5 years ago my husband forgot to take the half of the money from the bancomat – 2 min later it has gone. Not yet 1 year ago the same but worse happened to me – I forgot the hole money and 4 minutes later it has disappeared. I hoped, the bancomat had taken it back but at the end of month, there was no money left over – and the research has cost me about 10 Euro but no one has announced me that. I was really angry about that and someone I don’t know. He or she must know, that the 200 Euro did not belong to him/her – what explanation do you have for this attidtude?
In your book you write one reason for honesty is because of what is written on the Dollar bank note. What about other countries like Europe? Is it the same in general?
I would appreciate an answer.
Kind recards
Alexandra
Hi, I’m Dan Ariely. I do research in behavioral economics and try to describe it in plain language. These findings have enriched my life, and my hope is that they will do the same for you.
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Hey Dan,
Great video, I love your experiments.
Just finished your book. Quite interesting. Nice to see a bit about the “Muddy Charles” in print. Given your field and the theme of the book let me give you an anecdote from MIT 1954.
I took a hit in an economics course when I told Kindleberger that what he was teaching to us couldn’t be meaningful because it did not take into account peoples behavior. I don’t recall his reply exactly but it was something like how you describe Standard economics in your book. I do remember the barely C grade which I attribute to both my public criticism and my subsequent lack of faith in the field. Imagine my disgust(and relief) years later when a Noble Prize was awarded for the same thing. So the pavement for your path at MIT received a rough cut pebble even before your were born. Irrationality was the heart of Standard economics then as now.
email address correction
Let me give you an anecdote about “morality and character and the Muddy Charles. I was a “post-doctoral” student in the Nutrition and Food Science Dept., Course XX, in the late 60s early 70s. The MC was a popular meeting and drinking spot for a number of our grad students and junior faculty and the beer flowed freely. After buying (and paying)for a couple of rounds and the beer began it’s magic not only did it flow freely it began to flow “free”, libre de costo, at least for those who were in the keg-keepers in group. This free flow continued for some weeks and became to be almost an automatic expectation for some. Did we feel like we were stealing, No, did we consider we were stealing, of course not. It came as if it were a fringe benefit. Almost everyone there could rationalize things based on an assumption that at some point and at some time they had been screwed by the Institute, so lets get even. Besides we’d paid for some beers so, all having been exposed to Course XIV thinking, it was just a matter of the revenue per unit sale being a bit less than expected. No problem drinking that free beer. The flow lasted until the bean counters did find the revenue dropping below expectations and then it stopped. I don’t know of any punishment being administered. No doubt the statute of limitations expired long ago and MIT’s financial status seems quite sound. Probably helped, at least in part, by donations from the irrationally rationalizing imbibers. Perhaps their willingness to contribute to fund raising campaigns has been enhanced by memories of “free beer” at the Muddy Charles. If so, could that make it irrationally moral even though rationally illegal?
Another possible explanation for people not taking the dollar bills from the plate?
Dante: Theoretically, people see money on the counter, and no one around, they think they’re being watched.
Veronica: Honesty through paranoia.
– “Clerks”
After all, a plate of money in a refrigerator is an extremely abnormal situation… whereas, the cokes arouse far less suspicion of a trap.
Still, I agree with your basic conclusion.
(Disclaimer: I just watched the video, I haven’t (yet!) read the book.
)
(Also: I took your class, 1.5 years ago, and very much enjoyed it! Thanks.)
Hello Dan,
I just finished your book and I enjoyed it. Just the test with money and coke – there I miss something. Did you make the same test with writing one’s name on the coke? Did it disappear, too? The difference is obvious – this time people would know from whom they stole the coke. Maybe you need one insider in every kitchen so it is not easy to carry out?!
And unfortunately I have made twice a difference experience concerning money. 5 years ago my husband forgot to take the half of the money from the bancomat – 2 min later it has gone. Not yet 1 year ago the same but worse happened to me – I forgot the hole money and 4 minutes later it has disappeared. I hoped, the bancomat had taken it back but at the end of month, there was no money left over – and the research has cost me about 10 Euro but no one has announced me that. I was really angry about that and someone I don’t know. He or she must know, that the 200 Euro did not belong to him/her – what explanation do you have for this attidtude?
In your book you write one reason for honesty is because of what is written on the Dollar bank note. What about other countries like Europe? Is it the same in general?
I would appreciate an answer.
Kind recards
Alexandra